"Russia, which is blocked from other international payment systems."

Fair enough.

"We’re still throwing around fallacies like it’s 2010? Okay, I cast fallacy fallacy!"

Guess I'll simply parry with fallacy fallacy fallacy—quoting from your linked Wiki: "That one can invoke the argument from fallacy against a position does not prove one's own position either, as this would also be an argument from fallacy".

Your latter argument for the crypto cult is that the others are problematic too, therefore it's okay to join the cult. This invalid reasoning renders the entire conclusion void. I did not claim your conclusion is false, only that your reasoning is invalid.

"like it's 2010?"

There's no expiration date on logical reasoning.

"Cryptocurrencies are a tool, similar to how money is a tool. You can’t blame money itself for all the scummy shit done using it, similarly for cryptocurrencies."

A knife is a tool. Knives can be used for food and violence. However, knives do not persuade their users to buy as many knives as they can, they do not incentivize manipulating others to do so too, nor do knives inherently encourage violence. The exact opposite is true for crypto"currencies" because these are multi-level marketing pyramid schemes. As soon as one joins the Crypto Cult one benefits from recruiting new members—often by indoctrination and/or demagoguery.

"I guess some random HN user is smarter than the research arms of these companies who are all building on and utilizing crypto"

List of fallacies in the aforementioned statement:

• Ad hominem.
• Argument from authority.
• Bandwagon fallacy.

"I don’t have venmo, so I don’t use it. I don’t get mad when somebody offers it."

Venmo is not a multi-level marketing pyramid scheme, all crypto"currencies" are^["The only example of cryptocurrency not being a misnomer is TU Delft's blockchain euro [15]. But if it is practical remains to be seen since Africa has superior payment alternatives that don't require blockchain at all—which I address further down." —Crypto Cult Science].

"Depending on where users are located, it might be the only realistic option they have if they want to donate."

Could you give us an example of such a location please?

"Besides, traditional payment systems like PayPal, MasterCard, Visa etc are all problematic in their own right."

Whataboutism fallacy.

"There’s a legitimate use for crypto, to support something you use and (probably) enjoy, and you want them to remove it to set a good example?"

Of course they should remove it, for it is the moral thing to do. The only legitimate use is donating to entities who have their access to a bank account removed, e.g., whistle blowers, Z-Library, et cetera. In any other case it is an unethical instrument that brings out the worst in humanity.

"All of this existed (except the bit about nazi coins) already."

Whataboutism fallacy.

This whataboutism is probably the most used fallacy within the crypto"currency" sphere. If A and B cause cancer, and A was first, it doesn't follow that B is less malignant.

Quoted from my Crypto Cult Science essay linked in the original post:

“Strong currencies are not the solution to poor governance. Good governance and democracy makes a country and its currency strong. Not vice versa.” —halukakin, HackerNews, 2021

Never heard of Revolt before, nice.

As a community I'd use Revolt if my game/mod/whatever is built upon extensive bot functionality, and Matrix if not.

Exploited is accurate. But I'd personally wouldn't call Western countries "developing" to avoid ambiguity. Exploiting/exploited packs more punch and is unambiguous.

Imperial core countries causing climate change because of greed. The climate changes first in developing countries because of physics. The citizens of said developing countries flee to imperial core countries because of self-preservation. Imperial core citizens mad at fleeing citizens because of ignorance.

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Get them while they're young, just like religion. Anyone involved in this Crypto Cult Science is immoral.

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Eating the rich—if they tried.

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That adults are mature and know what they are doing.

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• The Exorcist (1973).
• Funny Games (1997).
• Eden Lake (2008).
• Dear Zachary: A Letter to a Son About His Father (2008).

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"If at first you don't succeed, blame immigrants." —Donald Musk

Literally Saruman.
Revolt happened.
Saruman died on a spike.

Mirror mirror on the wall, who is Nostradamus about Trump's fall?

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"Nearly 4 years in AI at M$. PhD from Harvard. She’s got a lot more to lose than the rest of us"

She has a BSc in Computer Science. There's no mention of a PhD on her LinkedIn.

For better legibility:

"Hi all,

As you might have just seen on the livestream or witnessed in person, I disrupted the speech of Microsoft AI CEO Mustafa Suleyman during the highly-anticipated 50th anniversary celebration. Here’s why.

My name is Ibtihal, and for the past 3.5 years, I’ve been a software engineer on Microsoft’s AI Platform org. I spoke up today because after learning that my org was powering the genocide of my people in Palestine, I saw no other moral choice. This is especially true when I’ve witnessed how Microsoft has tried to quell and suppress any dissent from my coworkers who tried to raise this issue. For the past year and a half, our Arab, Palestinian, and Muslim community at Microsoft has been silenced, intimidated, harassed, and doxxed, with impunity from Microsoft. Attempts at speaking up at best fell on deaf ears, and at worst, led to the firing of two employees for simply holding a vigil. There was simply no other way to make our voices heard.

We are witnessing a genocide

For the past 1.5 years, I’ve witnessed the ongoing genocide of the Palestinian people by Israel. I’ve seen unspeakable suffering amidst Israel’s mass human rights violations - indiscriminate carpet bombings, the targeting of hospitals and schools, and the continuation of an apartheid state - all of which have been condemned globally by the UN, ICC, and ICJ, and numerous human rights organizations. The images of innocent children covered in ash and blood, the wails of mourning parents, and the destruction of entire families and communities have forever fractured me.

At the time of writing, Israel has resumed its full-scale genocide in Gaza, which has so far killed by some estimates over 300,000 Gazans in the past 1.5 year alone. Just days ago, it was revealed that Israel killed fifteen paramedics and rescue workers in Gaza, executing them “one by one,” before burying them in the sand -- yet another horrific war crime. All the while, our “responsible” AI work powers this surveillance and murder. The United Nations and the International Court of Justice have concluded that this is a genocide, with the International Criminal Court issuing arrest warrants for Israeli leaders.

We are Complicit

When I moved to AI Platform, I was excited to contribute to cutting-edge AI technology and its applications for the good of humanity: accessibility products, translation services, and tools to “empower every human and organization to achieve more.” I was not informed that Microsoft would sell my work to the Israeli military and government, with the purpose of spying on and murdering journalists, doctors, aid workers, and entire civilian families. If I knew my work on transcription scenarios would help spy on and transcribe phone calls to better target Palestinians (source), I would not have joined this organization and contributed to genocide. I did not sign up to write code that violates human rights.

According to AP news, there is “a $133 million contract between Microsoft and Israel’s Ministry of Defense.”

“The Israeli military’s usage of Microsoft and OpenAI artificial intelligence spiked last March to nearly 200 times higher than before the week leading up to the Oct. 7 attack. The amount of data it stored on Microsoft servers doubled between that time and July 2024 to more than 13.6 petabytes.”

“The Israeli military uses Microsoft Azure to compile information gathered through mass surveillance, which it transcribes and translates, including phone calls, texts and audio messages, according to an Israeli intelligence officer who works with the systems. That data can then be cross-checked with Israel’s in-house targeting systems.”

Microsoft AI also powers the most “sensitive and highly classified projects” for the Israeli military, including its “target bank” and the Palestinian population registry. Microsoft cloud and AI enabled the Israeli military to be more lethal and destructive in Gaza than they otherwise could.

Microsoft has also been providing software, cloud services, and consulting services to the Israeli military and government, totaling millions in profit. War Criminal Benjamin Netanyahu has explicitly mentioned his strong ties to Microsoft. A list of these contracts with the Israeli military and government can be found here: An Introduction to Microsoft’s Complicity in Apartheid and Genocide

In fact, Microsoft is so deeply connected to the Israeli military that it was just yesterday designated one of the priority boycott targets of the BDS (Boycott, Divest, Sanctions) campaign.

Regardless of your political stances, is this the legacy we want to leave behind? Is working on deadly AI weapons something you can tell your children about? Do we want to be on the wrong side of history?

Even though your work could be unrelated to the cloud that the military uses, your work benefits the company and allows it to take on the contract. Regardless of your team, you serve a company that is arming the Israeli occupation. It is undeniable that part of your compensation, no matter how small, is being paid by genocide.

Whether you work on AI or not, you will be complicit if you do nothing. It is now OUR job to take a vocal stand against Microsoft AI’s involvement in crimes against humanity.

This is why I decided to speak up today, and why I signed this important petition to demand Microsoft cut ties with genocide. And I urge you all to do the same.

Call to Action

Silence is complicity. But action always has a reaction, no matter how big or small. As workers for this company, we must make our voices heard, and demand that Microsoft does the right thing: stop selling technology to the Israeli military.

If you are also concerned about this news, and you also want your work to be used ethically, I urge you to take action:

Sign the No Azure for Apartheid petition: We will not write code that kills. And join the campaign to add your voice to the growing number of concerned Microsoft employees.

Join me in showing our discontent in this thread. If you also feel tricked into deploying weapons which target children and civilians, urge leadership (CC’ed) to drop these contracts.

Don’t stop speaking up. Urge SLT to drop these contracts at every opportunity.

Start conversations with your co-workers about the points above - so many employees may not know!

Microsoft’s human rights statement prohibits retaliation against anyone who raises a human rights-related concern: Human rights statement | Microsoft CSR

Our company has precedents in supporting human rights, including divestment from apartheid South Africa and dropping contracts with AnyVision (Israeli facial recognition startup), after Microsoft employee and community protests. My hope is that our collective voices will motivate our AI leaders to do the same, and correct Microsoft’s actions regarding these human rights violations, to avoid a stained legacy. Microsoft Cloud and AI should stop being the bombs and bullets of the 21st century.

Sincerely,

A concerned Microsoft employee"

John Oliver is the actual president of the USA, society is just having a nightmare.

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They should've picked LibreWolf which ships with uBlock Origin. Brave is a disappointing choice because it supports multi-level marketing pyramid schemes which says enough about their moral compass.

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This would be convenient indeed, but I've learned to be indifferent about it as long as the manual or readme provides helpful and succinct information.