But given how recently they've dealt with Klingons, and especially given Nahla's relationship with Obel Wochak, how much sense does being out of practice actually make? It's not as if the Burn expunged all records of Klingon-Federation relations and the Federation had to rebuild from illuminated manuscripts copied by monks.

Don't get me wrong - I liked the focus on the Klingons and it answered a lot about what happened to the Empire after the Burn. I've had a soft spot for the Klingons ever since John M. Ford's The Final Reflection and the work that Ron Moore put in during TNG and DS9 and I was feeling really sad at seeing how far the Empire and the Klingon people had fallen.

I just think that the episode put too much heavy lifting responsibility on that last twist, because really, the solution was that obvious.

Now, I don't profess to be a writer (not anymore), but maybe the structure could have been different. Of course the debate isn’t supposed to affect policy, but the cadets could have debated it differently, and the adults watching to see if they reached the correct solution which was obvious (to them) all along.

I remember when I was in the equivalent of my junior year of high school, and coming up with what I thought was a brilliant insight into Shakespeare's Henry V, Part 1. All excited, I went to my English teacher and started blabbering about it. He listened patiently and let me finish, then said, "That's great. You know, it's been said before, but the important part is that you came up with it on your own."

A possibility could be centering the core of the cadet debate not so much on whether or not they should force a solution on the Klingons (which as I said is a non-starter because the PD should have settled the question very quickly), but how to get Faan Alpha into the hands of the Klingons without violating their autonomy.

Then you could still get Caleb to take the side of "fuck it, what's so good about the PD anyway?" and Jay-Den says, "But we have to remain who we are!"

And when Jay-Den has his epiphany, then the adults go, "Excellent. So this is what we're going to do." Because the adults have always known what had to be done but wanted the kids come to the conclusion on their own.

Then it doesn’t look like anyone is being an idiot.

1mo ago

Episode Discussion | Star Trek: Starfleet Academy | 1x04 "Vox in Excelso"

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khaosworks @startrek.website 1mo ago

The PD applies to everyone the Federation encounters, pre- or post-warp.

The PD prevented the Federation from intervening in Bajoran internal affairs (DS9: "The Circle"). It prevented the Federation from intervening in the Klingon Civil War (TNG: "Redemption"). It prevented Picard from interfering with the Kaelon tradition of elder euthanasia, despite Lwaxana's entreaties (TNG: "Half a Life") and with the Ligonian's racist culture (TNG: "Code of Honor"). Kirk assured the Vians that even though they were more advanced than the Federation, the PD applied to them as well (TOS: "The Empath").

The pre-warp and post-warp distinction is not about whether or not you get to interfere; it's just the useful and most common criterion for first contact, i.e. when it is likely safe enough that first contact - revealing the existence of aliens - will not immediately alter the social and technological order. And a world that has achieved warp drive will be finding out about aliens soon enough. And even then it can be assessed that a civilisation still isn't ready (TNG: "First Contact").

At the end of the day, the PD is about non-interference, period. TOS even calls it the "non-interference directive" in TOS: "The Apple", "A Piece of the Action" and "Patterns of Force". Picard calls it that in TNG: "Justice".

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1mo ago

Annotations for Star Trek: Starfleet Academy 1x04: “Vox In Excelso”

1mo ago

Episode Discussion | Star Trek: Starfleet Academy | 1x04 "Vox in Excelso"

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khaosworks @startrek.website 1mo ago

It was okay, and I like that we got some insight into why Jay-Den is the way he is.

But... to be honest, I’m not sure why this debate between Caleb and Jay-Den is even happening. If they’re going to throwing regulations and laws around, doesn’t the actual Prime Directive exist anymore? Because I’ve not heard a single mention of it. If the PD exists, you just don’t mess with the internal workings of a civilisation (TOS: “The Apple” and “The Return of the Archons” notwithstanding). You can offer, you can plead, but whether they accept is their choice and right, even if it means they go extinct because of it. Yes, I know it’s all a metaphor for Jay-Den’s internal struggles, and perhaps given how they’re debating the Prime Directive is now scattered across several statutes and case law instead of one all-encompassing General Order and other sub-orders (VOY: “Infinite Regress”). But when you’re talking about this kind of situation, it’s precisely the Prime Directive you should be using to frame the debate.

Also, I saw the ending coming from very early on in the episode - it’s the obvious solution, and they should have thought of it so much earlier. Yes, if conquest, not charity, is what Klingons care about, just let them “conquer” Faan Alpha!

1mo ago

Episode Discussion | Star Trek: Starfleet Academy | 1x04 "Vox in Excelso"

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khaosworks @startrek.website 1mo ago

Annotations for 1x04 are up at: https://startrek.website/post/34851748

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khaosworks @startrek.website

1mo ago

Annotations for Star Trek: Starfleet Academy 1x04: “Vox In Excelso”

1mo ago

Why I think Starfleet Academy takes place in 3191 and not 3195 as currently stated by Memory Alpha

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khaosworks @startrek.website 1mo ago

But if that's correct, Stardate 000001 would be 1923, and I'm not sure why that would be.

1mo ago

Why I think Starfleet Academy takes place in 3191 and not 3195 as currently stated by Memory Alpha

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khaosworks @startrek.website 1mo ago

Since TNG the system set up by Okuda has been more or less consistent, with a progression of 1000 stardate units a year.

Anything from the TOS period (including DIS and SNW) is still up for grabs, and since in post-DIS shows it’s been a bit wonky, but it’s still the best system we’ve got.

1mo ago

Why I think Starfleet Academy takes place in 3191 and not 3195 as currently stated by Memory Alpha

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khaosworks @startrek.website 1mo ago

SFA: “Vitus Reflux” starts with Darem saying it’s Stardate 868858.7, which works out to 3191, so that was very satisfying to hear.

1mo ago

Why I think Starfleet Academy takes place in 3191 and not 3195 as currently stated by Memory Alpha

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khaosworks @startrek.website 1mo ago

Yes, they did - on the face of it - switch to a Berman-era Stardate system of 1000 stardates to a year and 2364 (TNG Season 1) as a baseline for 41000.

But things got weird really fast.

So Burnham travels 930 years ahead of Discovery's original time (2258) to land in 3188 (as her suit computer said in DIS: "That Hope is You, Part 1") and spends a year in that time before Discovery itself showed up (DIS: "People of Earth"), so the year should have advanced to 3189.

Yet Burnham's log in "People of Earth" detailing how she spent her year without Discovery is dated 865211.3. If we work backwards to TNG: "Encounter at Farpoint", which took place on Stardate 41153.7 in the year 2364 (TNG: "The Neutral Zone"), that makes the 865000s the year 3188 instead, which can't really be.

Furthermore, if we are following the 1000 stardates equals 1 year convention, 221 stardate units brings us only to March 22 of that year, so we can't even say that she landed at the start of 3188 and made her log at the end of that year.

Then comes Season 4's DIS: "All is Possible", which has the stardate 865661.2, allegedly a week after the previous episode DIS: "Choose to Live", which places it back in 3188, and 661 stardate units takes us only to around August 29!

Season 4 starts five months after the end of Season 3 (as stated in Season 4's premiere DIS: "Kobayashi Maru"), and it's highly unlikely that Season 3 took place in the space of one month (between March and August is only six months). So whichever way you slice it, the Stardates are off by at least a year, if we're still following the TNG convention.

But that's not all. Season 5's DIS: "Under the Twin Moons" is on Stardate 866274.3, which places it in 3189. However, this is also an impossibility since, as I've noted, Burnham arrived in the 32nd Century in 3188, then spent a year before reuniting with Discovery (3189), then months passed between Seasons 3 and 4, and also between Seasons 4 and 5, so at a minimum it should be 3190. And in the very next episode DIS: "Jinaal", they definitively call the year as 3191.

If we lived in a sane universe, DIS Season 3 would have covered Stardates 865000-866999 (3188-3189), Season 4 Stardates 867000-867999 (3190), and Season 5 Stardates 868000 onwards (3191) and we could breathe a sigh of relief. But the given stardates don't.

One way to resolve it is to throw out what we knew about TNG stardates and just live with the idea that the 1000 stardate units stretch out over the course of 2-3 years. However, that idea makes this old Trek chronologist's face twitch.

1mo ago

Annotations for Star Trek: Starfleet Academy 1x03: “Vitus Reflux”

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khaosworks @startrek.website 1mo ago

He said in SFA: “Kids These Days” that he added an aging program to himself 500 years ago and he appears to remember the kids from Protostar, so this is the Voyager Doctor.