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powerstruggle

@ powerstruggle @sh.itjust.works

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784
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327
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6 mo. ago

Why?

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  • Look, I'll be direct. You are ignorant. You should fix that. This will help:

    "Male" and "female" in biology refer to gamete type (males make relatively small, motile gametes — sperm; females make relatively large, nutrient-rich gametes — eggs). The presence of different sperm sizes or extreme sperm variation in species like Drosophila is variation within the male gamete-producing sex, not a category that removes the fundamental distinction that males produce sperm and females produce eggs.

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  • You're confusing sex and Polymorphism. Those aren't different sexes

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  • I find it interesting how reliable of a tell it is that someone has just given up on any sort of real argument when they start deploying rhetorics like "boring" or the like. Very similar to "It's 2025!" or "I'm just tired y'all".

    Scientific truth doesn't care how boring you find it. That is the current scientific consensus, regardless of your opinion on it. Just like 1+1=2 doesn't care if you hate it with a passion. It's still true, and will continue to be so after you realize your error.

    Take your pick of other relevent scientists to believe if you want, though I have my doubts about Dawkins being "anti trans". This thread is an exemplar of how badly people want to conflate being pro-science with being anti-trans, for very silly reasons.

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  • Why do you think he's a transphobe? Because he's a biologist saying that sex is real?

    He's also simply one of the vast majority saying this. If you think acknowledging scientific truth is transphobic, that's entirely on you. Why do you think those are at odds?

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  • That's not my medium blog, that's someone else's link from elsewhere in this thread. Ironically, they posted it without realizing that it supports my point exactly.

    If you're unwilling to listen to real biologists tell you that what the scientific consensus is, then I don't think you're actually willing to change your mind. Which is fine, you can live your life however you want. Why bother pretending otherwise, though?

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  • When talking about the "sex vs gender" debate, you should 100% trust an evolutionary biologist more than a gender studies scholar on the "sex" part of that debate. I'm not sure why you think that's unclear.

    gametes are a binary

    Thank you, you're the first person in this thread that I've been arguing with to acknowledge that. Sports and whatnot are a different topic that is interesting to talk about, but first we have to get everyone on the same page of acknowledging the scientific consensus here that sex is binary and entirely defined by gamete size. Then we can start talking about how it affects sports.

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  • Sorry, you're down in the list of comments in my inbox. They'd look for structures like these for diagnosis:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paramesonephric_duct

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mesonephric_duct

    There aren't people born with bodies that just have "no concept" of how to produce a gamete, and that's what I mean our bodies aren't blank slates. Even if someone doesn't actually produce gametes, the rest of their body is still structured in a sexed way, because we're a sexually dimorphic species.

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  • Fortunately, someone else already posted a good response:

    https://medium.com/@alysion42/letter-to-the-us-president-and-congress-on-the-scientific-understanding-of-sex-and-gender-992051a60318

    Real biologists pointing out the scientific consensus:

    Anisogamy is the definition of sex

    and

    In animals and plants, binary sex is universally defined by gamete type, even though sexes vary in how they are developmentally determined and phenotypically identified across taxa.

    and

    the Tri-societies were wrong to speak in our names and claim that there is a scientific consensus without even conducting a survey of society members to see if such a consensus exists. Distorting reality to comply with ideology and using a misleading claim of consensus to give a veneer of scientific authority to your statement does more harm than just misrepresenting our views: it also weakens public trust in science, which has declined rapidly in the last few years.

    I mean, fuck's sake. There's nothing to argue about here. There's just the fact that this is the scientific consensus. Why does Lemmy want so very hard to be so very wrong?

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  • What would convince you that you were wrong? What foundations are your world view built on that might need some re-examining?

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  • I'm... not sure you actually read your link. It quotes the open letter, and then points out that it's scientifically inaccurate, and that the people that sent it should know better. It also contains this quote, which is my whole damn point. Real biologists saying this shit:

    In animals and plants, binary sex is universally defined by gamete type, even though sexes vary in how they are developmentally determined and phenotypically identified across taxa.

    Why is Lemmy so focused on being wrong here?

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  • I don't think you understand what definitions are in play, sadly.

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  • It's easy to throw around insults, but it would help if you started by not being wrong in the first place. SRY gene is part of how sex is determined, but not how sex is defined. Intersex conditions exist, but that's confusing terminology, and it's confused you. Those are male and female Disorders of sex development

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  • I wish it were as easy as "I'm just trolling", but Lemmy deserves better than lazy misinformation in their memes. I'm calling it out.

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  • What animals are those?

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  • Sorry, I wish you could believe that science accuracy is important. It's disappointing that you don't, but them's the breaks

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  • It's not what I believe. I'm just the messenger, sorry but you are disagreeing with the scientific and academic consensus. I wish I didn't have to do this and people didn't post a bunch of nonsense on Lemmy, but here we are.

    People really need to know when their worldview is based on falsehoods, and this is one of those times. As an example, you might have heard of the concept of "5 sexes", but it turns out that the source of that claim was someone who certainly knows better being "tongue-in-cheek" and "ironic":

    She's also the source of the "intersex is as common as redheads" claim, and that's also completely wrong and she should know better. That is a silly thing and she's one of the extremists pushing such silly things.

    I don't know how to better explain it to you, but yes, sex characteristics are not necessarily binary, but sex is (and yes, gametes are binary). You're refusing to acknowledge the scientific consensus, and that's really disappointing.

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  • That's not some random blogger lol. That's an evolutionary biologist that certainly should be trusted more on the topic than Judith Butler of all people. The link is more to demonstrate why you should evaluate why you're wrong and how you ended up there (believing Judith Butler is a good starting point). I didn't directly respond to your points because you didn't seem to be arguing ("I let you decide on your own.")

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  • lol, fuck trump. He's a fascist shitstain. I know you want me to be someone you can hate like a right-winger, but that's not how it works.

    Intersex can be a confusing term, and it's confused you. People can be born with a Disorder of sex development, but those are male and female DSDs, not just some vague 🤷 category.

    (Also, the intersex as common as red hair thing is wrong. It's based on a bad definition of intersex by someone that should've known better, and has pulled the "just a prank bro" response when called out on it)